2015.01.30 Dev Chat

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On Chat Mods & Feature Dev

rhiju: hey everyone! [0:00 AM]

Eli Fisker: Hi Rhiju [0:00 AM]

lroppy: Hi Rhiju [0:00 AM]

hoglahoo: Hi Rhiju [0:00 AM]

rhiju: @lroppy, whine away.... [0:00 AM]

lroppy: our incentives are all wrong [0:00 AM]

lroppy: especially with space bar puzzles [0:00 AM]

lroppy: new people come on [0:00 AM]

lroppy: and start hitting the space bar puzzles [0:01 AM]

lroppy: they can earn thousands  of points for doing nothing [0:01 AM]

lroppy: almost unlock the lab  [0:01 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: hey rhiju [0:01 AM]

lroppy: if we include the nova tutorials too [0:01 AM]

janelle: Hi rhiju [0:01 AM]

lroppy: we need to rework the incentive system [0:01 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: ^^ [0:02 AM]

rhiju: @lroppy, agreed [0:02 AM]

Eli Fisker: Speaking of Nova tutorials [0:02 AM]

lroppy: I put up a proposal callede weakbot [0:02 AM]

rhiju: link to weakbot? [0:02 AM]

lroppy: which would allow no points for puzzles solved by weakbot [0:02 AM]

lroppy: on our forum [0:02 AM]

Eli Fisker: Hoglahoo suggested that they got promoted something like this too:  [0:03 AM]

Eli Fisker: https://d2r1vs3d9006ap.cloudfront.net/s3_images/1149668/NOVA.png?1422658930 [0:03 AM]

rhiju: oooh cool [0:03 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lroppy means puzzles that can get solved by a bot, won't get points [0:03 AM]

rhiju: an alternative is to have early puzzles solved by bots [0:03 AM]

lroppy: especially a simple minded bot [0:03 AM]

lroppy: like if all GC's or just a space bar push solves it [0:03 AM]

lroppy: then no points [0:04 AM]

lroppy: make all you want like this [0:04 AM]

lroppy: but take them out of action for incentives [0:04 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: that's not a bad idea.. [0:04 AM]

lroppy: thx Tomoe [0:04 AM]

RedSpah: that's actually a bloody good idea [0:04 AM]

lroppy: ha ha thx Red [0:04 AM]

lroppy: also [0:04 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: every puzzle could be verified by bots..? maybe? [0:04 AM]

mat747: Rhiju - we need a Foldit style cookbook to help us [0:04 AM]

janelle: Iroppy is right, you can get thousands like that [0:05 AM]

lroppy: we have narrowed our comunity toa small cohort [0:05 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: heh lroppy [0:05 AM]

lroppy: maybe not intentionally [0:05 AM]

lroppy: but we scare folks away pretty fast [0:05 AM]

lroppy: we have days with hours of no chat and no players [0:05 AM]

Eli Fisker: And a majority of our new players still don't find the NOVA tutorials [0:06 AM]

Eli Fisker: We need to get them more prominently shown [0:06 AM]

lroppy: maybe have a gate to unlock player puzzles [0:06 AM]

lroppy: they are on menu eli [0:06 AM]

Eli Fisker: Hogla suggested this as a start:  [0:06 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: a gate? [0:06 AM]

Eli Fisker: https://d2r1vs3d9006ap.cloudfront.net/s3_images/1149668/NOVA.png?1422658930 [0:06 AM]

lroppy: like unlock player puzzles after X points [0:06 AM]

janelle: Iroppy, that's a great idea [0:06 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lroppy, but folks still don't find them [0:06 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: lroppy, maybe [0:06 AM]

Eli Fisker: They find the old ones [0:07 AM]

lroppy: true [0:07 AM]

lroppy: I tell newbs tht it is on the menu [0:07 AM]

Omei: Hi, all [0:07 AM]

Eli Fisker: I think it needs to be the first thing suggested to them [0:07 AM]

Eli Fisker: hi Omei :) [0:07 AM]

lroppy: not sure we can do a lot more on that [0:07 AM]

Eli Fisker: But they get autotracked into the old tutorials [0:07 AM]

Eli Fisker: that ought to happen for the new instead [0:07 AM]

lroppy: yes [0:07 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: hey Omei [0:07 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: we could integrate the nova tutorials [0:07 AM]

lroppy: would be good approach too [0:08 AM]

hoglahoo: It can be one of the things offered to new players who sign up and don't know what to do do next. There's a big green button that says "GO" - that could exist next to a nova button [0:08 AM]

hoglahoo: "Congrats you've signed up! Please consider playing these tutorials "GO" or looking here, there etc" [0:08 AM]

lroppy: (3) also - we need better balance on lab "burden" [0:09 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: ? [0:09 AM]

hoglahoo: instead of hiding it in a menu they won't find until they've stumbled around for days [0:09 AM]

janelle: Iroppy, what do you mean [0:09 AM]

lroppy: if we have 30 sublabs -- that is an enormous commitment of time [0:09 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: oh yeah [0:09 AM]

hoglahoo: I agree with weakbot being an improvement [0:09 AM]

Eli Fisker: Same here [0:10 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: ditto [0:10 AM]

Eli Fisker: Many forget about the labs because tons of puzzles [0:10 AM]

lroppy: labs are currently constructed to eat too much time  [0:10 AM]

lroppy: especially if you want us to actually analyze past results [0:10 AM]

hoglahoo: Yeah actually even though we came up with thousands of submissions last time - I honestly don't see that happening more than once without an influx of a lot of new players :/ [0:11 AM]

lroppy: jsut to design 30 shapes with no data analysis is a many many hour task [0:11 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: true [0:11 AM]

hoglahoo: (or bots) [0:11 AM]

lroppy: and lots bigger task to do the analysis [0:11 AM]

mat747: lroppy - would have a test with weakbot in the puzzle maker ? [0:11 AM]

janelle: You wind up doing a "shotgun" approach in lab because of so many wanted [0:11 AM]

lroppy: mat - optional [0:11 AM]

lroppy: space bar puzzles - they know [0:12 AM]

lroppy: and for others, not urgent [0:12 AM]

lroppy: not trying to stop them [0:12 AM]

lroppy: tey will leanr when puzzle is published with zero points [0:12 AM]

lroppy: *they will learn [0:12 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: ^^ [0:12 AM]

rhiju: ok, how about this... [0:13 AM]

machinelves: if labs were chunked into smaller steps which were each incentivized, and the UI / UX were as easy as puzzles, we would increase retention rate & lab output [0:13 AM]

rhiju: let's set up a getsat thread and collect these proposals [0:13 AM]

lroppy: yes to elves! [0:13 AM]

rhiju: and then decide what should happen [0:13 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: elves that's a really good idea [0:13 AM]

machinelves: here's the transcript from earlier btw, there was some convo after that may be illuminating http://eternawiki.org/wiki/index.php5/2015.01.30_State_of_Eterna_9am_PST [0:13 AM]

rhiju: i am getting a designer involved [0:13 AM]

lroppy: weakbot is alreay out there [0:13 AM]

lroppy: on getsat [0:13 AM]

Eli Fisker: Thx, Elf [0:14 AM]

janelle: Perhaps another ranking with labs, points? IDK, just a thought [0:14 AM]

machinelves: np :) [0:14 AM]

rhiju: ok, how about let's add to that thread [0:14 AM]

rhiju: i am following it now [0:14 AM]

lroppy: https://getsatisfaction.com/eternagame/topics/enabling_zero_score_puzzles_if_weakbot_can_solve [0:14 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lroppy, plus JL's scripts are very good at solving puzzles [0:14 AM]

rhiju: and i can reply with thoughts there [0:14 AM]

rhiju: we have an extremely good designer who wants to help us -- i am not sure if he can code yet. [0:15 AM]

lroppy: not sure how far to push it [0:15 AM]

lroppy: want to get rid of the junky ones [0:15 AM]

rhiju: but if so, we could let him loose on a dev server to improve flow [0:15 AM]

rhiju: @elves, the problem right now is that labs are never going to be easy [0:16 AM]

Eli Fisker: Link to latest JL update of his puzzle solving script which has a runtime of 60 sec, meaning it can solve more than most of the puzzle solving scripts in the scripting area:  [0:16 AM]

Eli Fisker: http://eterna.cmu.edu/web/script/5291784/ [0:16 AM]

rhiju: once they become easy as puzzles, they won't be labs uncovering new science anymore [0:16 AM]

rhiju: how about this idea  though [0:16 AM]

machinelves: i respectfully disagree [0:16 AM]

rhiju: for each lab, instead of having a long description we have a field called 'prerequisites'  [0:16 AM]

rhiju: or something more enticing  [0:16 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: heh [0:17 AM]

rhiju: and it would included tutorial puzzles that would get a player up to speed [0:17 AM]

Eli Fisker: But we need to get better UI to support work, so we don't have so much unnecessary clicking while moving around [0:17 AM]

Eli Fisker: between designs [0:17 AM]

machinelves: left right nav arrows to go between entries per round [0:17 AM]

machinelves: chunk reading description & prereqs into their own rewarded sections [0:17 AM]

Eli Fisker: Nando just made a fine button update [0:18 AM]

rhiju: agreed on arrows [0:18 AM]

Eli Fisker: so we don't have to click "go away" on the bottom, each time we copy a sequence [0:18 AM]

rhiju: here's what we have to do... [0:18 AM]

machinelves: browse nav for rounds within puzzle UI [0:18 AM]

mat747: I agree with eli "better UI to support work" and new tools [0:18 AM]

rhiju: siqi in my lab is updating the sequence browser for RMDB [0:18 AM]

lroppy: concur 8-) [0:18 AM]

machinelves: there is the list Mat Eli & I put together for Walt, maybe one of us can find [0:18 AM]

machinelves: on lab UI / UX [0:18 AM]

Eli Fisker: We can find list with good ideas for improvement [0:19 AM]

rhiju: and he just discovered D3.js (that's a powerful system for visualizing everything) [0:18 AM]

rhiju: we have to convince him to spend a month after updating RMDB to work on eterna... [0:19 AM]

rhiju: be nive to him, as he's checking out getsat, etc. [0:19 AM]

lroppy: grab our new product [0:19 AM]

lroppy: it is free [0:19 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: haha [0:19 AM]

lroppy: and powerful [0:19 AM]

lroppy: Watson Analytics [0:19 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lroppy :) [0:19 AM]

lroppy: looks for correlations in large data sets [0:19 AM]

Omei: I would love to have 3D in the game [0:19 AM]

machinelves: many thanks for the work on rmdb [0:20 AM]

rhiju: lol watson [0:20 AM]

lroppy: given the way 3D was prototyped, I am concerned about it [0:20 AM]

lroppy: watson was founder of IBM [0:20 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lroppy, here is my application for Watson:  [0:20 AM]

Eli Fisker: https://getsatisfaction.com/eternagame/topics/dear_watson [0:20 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: lroppy what exactly..? [0:20 AM]

machinelves: :D [0:20 AM]

rhiju: @lroppy, well there's a reason eterna3D is not deployed ... [0:20 AM]

lroppy: fair enough [0:21 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: rhij: :) [0:21 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: *rhiju [0:21 AM]

lroppy: I thought mat suggested we try to learn a bit more about how Foldit approached it [0:21 AM]

lroppy: with recipes (??) [0:21 AM]

lroppy: not sure [0:21 AM]

Omei: @lroppy, agreed.  Just enabling 3D is not necessarily going to get us anywhere. [0:21 AM]

Eli Fisker: Yes, for 3D to work, we have a lot to learn from Foldit. And as I see it, it takes a whole team of doing it [0:22 AM]

lroppy: and we need more of a biology glossary [0:22 AM]

hoglahoo: oculus rift + eterna [0:22 AM]

rhiju: but we can prototype some 3D visualization on RMDB [0:22 AM]

RedSpah: 10/10 [0:22 AM]

lroppy: we used to have alan.robot to explain stuff [0:22 AM]

machinelves: i see a need for design & dev time to get things flowing well. and attention to community health [0:22 AM]

lroppy: ligands and aptamers [0:22 AM]

Eli Fisker: Agree with Elf [0:23 AM]

Omei: But I have learned a lot by using external tools to build 3D models of lab designs and comparing them with the SHAPE data [0:22 AM]

lroppy: and we are (correctlY) inventing new terms [0:22 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: hehe hog, oculus [0:22 AM]

machinelves: players bend over backwards to meet lab quotas, despite the frustration [0:23 AM]

lroppy: someone who begins now has a larger hill to climb to understand what we speak about in labs [0:23 AM]

machinelves: not sure they can scale up to 100k/month at the current level of infrastructure [0:23 AM]

rhiju: eterna was originally a port of foldit for rna, but it didn't produce structures or sequences that were compelling enough that my lab would actually make them [0:23 AM]

Eli Fisker: We need to be better to keep players around [0:23 AM]

lroppy: strongly agree [0:23 AM]

rhiju: for 3D, need a new game with a large dev team  [0:23 AM]

lroppy: our attrition rate is enormous [0:23 AM]

mat747: lroppy - Recipes in foldit improved the science and spread the knowledge [0:23 AM]

machinelves: also would help to keep chat pleasant, since we are not nannies, we are just players [0:24 AM]

janelle: I am concerned that there are excellent puzzlers who won't attempt/do lab, and Iroppy is right, the hill is very steep from beginning puzzles to lab. To steep, actually, just look at microRNA for them to try. [0:24 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: elves- yeah [0:24 AM]

machinelves: it gets embarrassing enough that i wont be inviting my professional colleagues here until that is fixed [0:24 AM]

machinelves: despite some are deeply involved in cutting edge 3D work [0:24 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: more chat mods maybe? [0:25 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: trigger words for auto banning or something? [0:25 AM]

machinelves: i don't want player mods, i want professional representation [0:25 AM]

machinelves: i feel harassed and like i have nobody to talk to about it [0:25 AM]

machinelves: and there are others [0:25 AM]

rhiju: removing chat would solve the issue too -- thoughts? [0:25 AM]

Omei: Rhiju, a totally 3D oriented game would be awsome.  But just being abte to see 3D representations as well as 2D would be a big a big boon, with relatively little development effort [0:25 AM]

machinelves: it needs to be fixed [0:25 AM]

Eli Fisker: Rhiju, but chat is how we teach each other [0:26 AM]

machinelves: chat is why we have a community [0:26 AM]

hoglahoo: I like chat and wouldn't like to see it removed, but it would certainly solve that particular issue [0:26 AM]

lroppy: agreed [0:26 AM]

machinelves: otherwise you just have foldit style competition [0:26 AM]

Eli Fisker: Without community even fewer contributers [0:26 AM]

lroppy: the amount of competition is related to the incentives now [0:26 AM]

rhiju: is the fix to have more chat mods? [0:26 AM]

hoglahoo: Just as removing the rank system would solve the problem of players feeling obligated to solve dot puzzles [0:26 AM]

rhiju: elected chat mods? [0:26 AM]

machinelves: our community being tightly knit and caring about each other is why anyone is here at all [0:26 AM]

machinelves: no [0:26 AM]

machinelves: i repeat: professional representation [0:26 AM]

lroppy: or have modified ranking system [0:26 AM]

lroppy: once you reach xxx points, you are on different scheme or structure [0:27 AM]

mat747: I agree with hog [0:27 AM]

hoglahoo: lroppy: yeah that's my point. lets not throw out the baby with the bathwater [0:27 AM]

rhiju: 24/7 chat mods? [0:27 AM]

hoglahoo: chat is dead [0:27 AM]

lroppy: naw [0:27 AM]

machinelves: we are not psychologists, we are players. we should not have the responsibility for handling shenanigans, we are here to teach players about science and the game [0:27 AM]

lroppy: eterna is quiet many hours per day now [0:27 AM]

hoglahoo: moderating chat is kinda low priority [0:27 AM]

lroppy: concur [0:27 AM]

hoglahoo: as long as there is at least one active person to kick out a flood spam it's fine [0:27 AM]

hoglahoo: (imo) [0:27 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: yeah [0:27 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: well we could have chat mods on shifts.. [0:28 AM]

hoglahoo: chat was three times more active 18 months ago [0:28 AM]

rhiju: ok have to go soon -- this has been a really useful discussion [0:28 AM]

hoglahoo: and we did fine [0:28 AM]

Bushy333: um in a noob a just started whats going on [0:28 AM]

Eli Fisker: I agree with Elf that someone on the dev teem should read chatlogs, to have a feel with what goes on in the community [0:28 AM]

lroppy: and chat gets worse when certain players are present and tossing junk at newbs who are teens [0:28 AM]

rhiju: other questions? [0:28 AM]

machinelves: the removing rank or different kinds of leaderboards may help, as mat and hog said [0:28 AM]

machinelves: then the competitive aspect would be removed [0:28 AM]

hoglahoo: thanks rhiju [0:28 AM]

lroppy: I would alter the ranking [0:28 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: lroppy- how so? [0:28 AM]

Eli Fisker: Yes, after certain point, since we are here to help  [0:28 AM]

machinelves: yes with kids here, we have a deep responsibility [0:28 AM]

Eli Fisker: Agree with Elf [0:29 AM]

machinelves: especially inviting lots of classrooms with nova [0:29 AM]

lroppy: making broader goals - achieve science wizard status [0:29 AM]

lroppy: and then different incentives to level up after that [0:29 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lroppy, love it [0:29 AM]

lroppy: based on lab analysis [0:29 AM]

RedSpah: but not at a cost of keeping chat spam-free [0:29 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: lroppy- YES [0:29 AM]

rhiju: agreed on leveling [0:29 AM]

lroppy: and collaboration [0:29 AM]

machinelves: foldit has weekly or monthly leaderboards so the new get a chance to see their name up [0:29 AM]

Eli Fisker: We are here to find out stuff [0:29 AM]

lroppy: and submitting lab projects [0:29 AM]

machinelves: lroppy love that hahaha science wizard, awesome [0:29 AM]

lroppy: let me take out my magic +3 wand of folding [0:30 AM]

machinelves: also, leaderboards for specialized areas like best in labs, best in switch etc. [0:30 AM]

machinelves: so that people can diversify specialty and not feel need to spacebar [0:30 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lroppy :) [0:30 AM]

hoglahoo: @machinelves, that's coming soon with the algorithm wars :D [0:30 AM]

hoglahoo: RIP [0:30 AM]

machinelves: hahaha [0:30 AM]

RedSpah: soon [0:30 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: vaporware ayy [0:30 AM]

machinelves: actually jnicols player stats spreadsheet nearly does this already [0:31 AM]

machinelves: could plug into ui [0:31 AM]

hoglahoo: yeah that thing is so nifty [0:31 AM]

lroppy: and brourd showed part of the way [0:32 AM]

lroppy: on incentives [0:32 AM]

lroppy: the "contest" that we ultimately agreed to [0:32 AM]

lroppy: on FMNSanity [0:32 AM]

lroppy: in December [0:32 AM]

lroppy: proves how incentives, even small ones [0:32 AM]

lroppy: will motivate particiaption [0:32 AM]

machinelves: yes he sent me a pm arguing how i was wrong about that then went and implemented it lol [0:33 AM]

machinelves: hilarious [0:33 AM]

lroppy: we leap for points in current environment [0:33 AM]

lroppy: jnicol implemented it [0:33 AM]

machinelves: yes [0:33 AM]

lroppy: after negotiating with me [0:33 AM]

lroppy: and others [0:33 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: haha [0:33 AM]

lroppy: I thought it was a good balance [0:33 AM]

lroppy: solved most of my objections [0:33 AM]

lroppy: and that is not easy [0:33 AM]

lroppy: given how mcuh I like to whine   8-) [0:33 AM]

machinelves: yes well these things don't get resolved by magic elves... o wait they do [0:33 AM]

hoglahoo: ha [0:33 AM]

lroppy: ha ha [0:34 AM]

machinelves: :) [0:34 AM]

Eli Fisker: :) [0:34 AM]

hoglahoo: Lroppy nobody ever accused you of being a yes-man [0:34 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: heh [0:34 AM]

lroppy: we need graduated goals [0:34 AM]

lroppy: here we have unlock lab @10K [0:34 AM]

lroppy: and unlock puzzlemaker @20K [0:34 AM]

lroppy: and then nada [0:34 AM]

machinelves: i like the idea of badges and achievements that are not explicitly point related [0:34 AM]

lroppy: keep the points [0:35 AM]

lroppy: use them better [0:35 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: yeah. [0:35 AM]

lroppy: to incent more stuff [0:35 AM]

lroppy: and gates [0:35 AM]

machinelves: in addition not instead [0:35 AM]

Eli Fisker: I would like the Switch puzzles to get a lot more badges [0:35 AM]

lroppy: badges = gates too [0:35 AM]

lroppy: fine [0:35 AM]

machinelves: yes [0:35 AM]

Eli Fisker: Because we need a lot of players with good switch solving skills [0:35 AM]

lroppy: also [0:35 AM]

janelle: The leap is to great and confusing to go from 10,000 single state points to switches and dimers in lab [0:36 AM]

rhiju: ok jnicol and i are talking about alternative rankings [0:36 AM]

Eli Fisker: To solve the lab problems we dealing with and will face in future [0:36 AM]

lroppy: yup [0:36 AM]

lroppy: now don't put it in b4 I catch jess ;-) [0:36 AM]

rhiju: quick question [0:36 AM]

machinelves: @jnicol like add a column for total lab points earned, and/or total lab designs made and/or highest average lab score. none of those is perfect, but together give a picture of lab participation [0:36 AM]

machinelves: then can pull rankings from that [0:36 AM]

janelle: I think, to emphasize the lab more [0:37 AM]

rhiju: if we allow leaderboard (Comunity) to be sorted in different ways [0:37 AM]

machinelves: for lab leaderboard [0:37 AM]

rhiju: what should the default sort be? [0:37 AM]

rhiju: points in the last week? [0:37 AM]

Eli Fisker: Good idea, Elf [0:37 AM]

machinelves: default should be your highest science priority [0:37 AM]

machinelves: like labs [0:37 AM]

Eli Fisker: And there are alreadys cripts that can find some of those [0:37 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: ooh yeah [0:37 AM]

hoglahoo: given current activity levels I would lean more toward points in the last month [0:37 AM]

machinelves: where you put points, is where people spend time [0:37 AM]

lroppy: y [0:37 AM]

Eli Fisker: Hoglahoo is right [0:37 AM]

machinelves: thanks, and agree with hogla [0:37 AM]

Eli Fisker: And so true, Elf [0:38 AM]

janelle: If the ultimate goal for eterna is lab progress then, that needs to reflect in rank, etc. [0:38 AM]

lroppy: and [0:38 AM]

Eli Fisker: For now it takes actively ignoring puzzle, to get to lab work [0:38 AM]

machinelves: yes, assume new players will not know how to toggle rank options [0:38 AM]

machinelves: default is most important [0:38 AM]

lroppy: we need to have some research that starts moving away from synth that we know does not work [0:38 AM]

lroppy: improving the energy model [0:38 AM]

lroppy: not same thread as riboswitches [0:38 AM]

lroppy: but maybe just as important [0:39 AM]

lroppy: bizarre to keep using model we know does not predict lab synth [0:39 AM]

lroppy: like all GCs [0:39 AM]

rhiju: ok i've got to go [0:39 AM]

machinelves: yes a lot of new get confused by that [0:39 AM]

lroppy: thx for listening, R [0:39 AM]

janelle: Thank you rhiju [0:39 AM]

starryjess: hm, first sentence I can read in chat when I log on: "now don't put it in b4 I catch jess ;-) " :P [0:39 AM]

Eli Fisker: Thx for the chat, Rhiju [0:39 AM]

machinelves: thanks and good luck! [0:39 AM]

Eli Fisker: Hi Starry :) [0:40 AM]

hoglahoo: heh [0:40 AM]

lroppy: hi jess   8-) [0:39 AM]

lroppy: ha ha ha [0:40 AM]

janelle: hi starry [0:40 AM]

rhiju: @starry -- sorry i missed you! [0:40 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: heh hey jess [0:40 AM]

rhiju: good night everyone... [0:40 AM]

hoglahoo: yeah let me build up a backlog of easy puzzles before you implement the new rank sorting [0:40 AM]

hoglahoo: bye rhiju [0:40 AM]

Eli Fisker: Bye [0:40 AM]

machinelves: hi starry! [0:40 AM]

starryjess: hi all :) [0:40 AM]

machinelves: bye rhiju! [0:40 AM]

lroppy: ha ha hog [0:40 AM]

janelle: haha hog [0:40 AM]

Eli Fisker: Lol, Hogla [0:40 AM]

TomoeUzumaki: bye rhiju [0:40 AM]

machinelves: hahaha [0:40 AM]

lroppy: good chat all [0:40 AM]

starryjess: night rhiju [0:40 AM]

hoglahoo: And a good whine was had by all [0:40 AM]

lroppy: exactly [0:41 AM]

Eli Fisker: in the hard easy definition of the word [0:41 AM]

hoglahoo: I mean a good time [0:41 AM]

Eli Fisker: haha [0:41 AM]

machinelves: hehe you mean we can't solve problems by ignoring them?! [0:41 AM]

lroppy: down down you punny guy [0:41 AM]

janelle: rhiju, thank you for putting up with us...:) [0:41 AM]